Books you are currently reading

[FANTASTIC WOUND]

Dante's Inferno, translation by John Ciardi.
Under the Dome, the new Stephen King. OPEN THE FLAMING FLOODGATES

[Hollow]

OPEN THE FLAMING FLOODGATES

This needs to be the name of a shitty deathcore band.

[FANTASTIC WOUND]

OPEN THE FLAMING FLOODGATES

This needs to be the name of a shitty deathcore band.

If it isn't already...

[grungePIG]

for school i'm currently reading blood meridian by cormac mccarthy .

i tried to read that, after being recommended by a friend, but couldn't get past a quarter... I didn't like his writing style. Do you like it so far?
I've been told that The Road is a more accessible book so i plan on reading that soon.

his writing can be pretty frustrating at times but i am really liking it. the most interesting thing i've had to read this semester at least.
i haven't read the road but i read no country for old men last summer and i found it way more difficult than blood meridian, just because there is so much more dialogue and since mccarthy hates punctuation of any kind it got pretty confusing.

[grungePIG]

i don't want to get into how much i love vonnegut...cat's cradle is one of my favorite books of all time.

i've been reading the sirens of titan (also vonnegut) for quite a while but school is destroying my life so i haven't had time to finish.

The Sirens of Titan was the first Vonnegut book I ever read when I was 19. It's also probably his darkest. Cat's Cradle is also damn good, but Sirens is my personal favorite.

i only have about 60 pages left to read i just feel guilty every time i try to sit down and finish it (i have 16 novels to read for school this semester so personal reading is against the rules). it's definitely one of his best that i've read though.

[Hollow]

i don't want to get into how much i love vonnegut...cat's cradle is one of my favorite books of all time.

i've been reading the sirens of titan (also vonnegut) for quite a while but school is destroying my life so i haven't had time to finish.

The Sirens of Titan was the first Vonnegut book I ever read when I was 19. It's also probably his darkest. Cat's Cradle is also damn good, but Sirens is my personal favorite.

i only have about 60 pages left to read i just feel guilty every time i try to sit down and finish it (i have 16 novels to read for school this semester so personal reading is against the rules). it's definitely one of his best that i've read though.

It's gonna be one of those things where at the end, you'll be all "Hey, that was kinda sweet, what was Willa talking about it being dark?" and then it will hit you out of nowhere, and you will begin drinking.

[AC]

Fahrenheit 451 in graphic novel form - unreal!

[xchadx]

.

[KYLESTYLE]

Last week I read..

I Drink For A Reason by David Cross. .

I should read this one day considering everything that man does is gold.

Animal Liberation by Peter Singer.

brilliant.

[KYLESTYLE]

Fahrenheit 451 in graphic novel form - unreal!

i love that book. graphic novel, though???

[grind/bro]

Animal Liberation by Peter Singer.

brilliant.

Can you outline his arguments for this? Not to totally be like FUCK ANIMAL RIGHTS, but I am not sure we should be rushing to animal rights, before we completely liberate humanity.

[KYLESTYLE]

Animal Liberation by Peter Singer.

brilliant.

Can you outline his arguments for this? Not to totally be like FUCK ANIMAL RIGHTS, but I am not sure we should be rushing to animal rights, before we completely liberate humanity.

what exactly do mean by 'completely liberate humanity'? do you mean in actuality or in philosophical terms? neither really makes sense to me...

it's been a couple of years since i read it, but i know i have notes somewhere.

[xchadx]

.

[grind/bro]

Animal Liberation by Peter Singer.

brilliant.

Can you outline his arguments for this? Not to totally be like FUCK ANIMAL RIGHTS, but I am not sure we should be rushing to animal rights, before we completely liberate humanity.

what exactly do mean by 'completely liberate humanity'? do you mean in actuality or in philosophical terms? neither really makes sense to me...

it's been a couple of years since i read it, but i know i have notes somewhere.

Both. Philosophical liberation drawn out into physical, systemic and everything else. It all works hand in hand. It's like saying "Oh let's fix the mess we made" instead of saying "Hey lets change the way we make things, so that messes are not created in the future.". I'm all for the liberation of animals sure, but how many technologically depraved people are there in this world when we have the tools to give them the "leg" up so to speak? Or why are we worrying about animal liberation instead of being able to contribute food to the starving? The list could go on and on. To me it's been that if we can re-analyze what works, what liberates us as people, and what aids us in forming intimiate bonds with the earth itself, we then liberate everything around us that has been ensnared by our maligned culture.

[Andrew]

Or why are we worrying about animal liberation instead of being able to contribute food to the starving?

You really should read this book, or A book on animal liberation. Want to feed the world's populace? Stop eating beef. The world produces enough grain each year to rid the world of hunger, but instead of feeding people with it it goes to feeding cows. These problems are connected.

[grind/bro]

Or why are we worrying about animal liberation instead of being able to contribute food to the starving?

You really should read this book, or A book on animal liberation. Want to feed the world's populace? Stop eating beef. The world produces enough grain each year to rid the world of hunger, but instead of feeding people with it it goes to feeding cows. These problems are connected.

Oh I totally agree, but to say the absolute answer is "Stop eating beef" seems a little simplistic. How will our culture economically adapt to such a massive shift of everyone suddenly stopping eating beef? Not saying it shouldn't happen but there needs to be more than just black and white answers.

[officespace]

Wow just found out that Howard Zinn died. RIP BROTHA

[KYLESTYLE]

Or why are we worrying about animal liberation instead of being able to contribute food to the starving?

You really should read this book, or A book on animal liberation. Want to feed the world's populace? Stop eating beef. The world produces enough grain each year to rid the world of hunger, but instead of feeding people with it it goes to feeding cows. These problems are connected.

Oh I totally agree, but to say the absolute answer is "Stop eating beef" seems a little simplistic. How will our culture economically adapt to such a massive shift of everyone suddenly stopping eating beef? Not saying it shouldn't happen but there needs to be more than just black and white answers.

your argument seems a little flawed. You're saying that because it would be too great of a stress on the systems involved in the 'meat' industry as well as world systems, we shouldn't allow animals to have rights? Also, you're saying because there is still human suffering, we should eliminate that before we allow other sentient beings their rights? sounds like you have a hierarchy where non-human animals are given zero rights. Also, no one claimed the 'answer' was stop eating meat...

Honestly, read Peter Singer's paper, 'A Utilitarian Defense of Animal Liberation'. it's about 5 pages and answers those arguments.

[Andrew]

Or why are we worrying about animal liberation instead of being able to contribute food to the starving?

You really should read this book, or A book on animal liberation. Want to feed the world's populace? Stop eating beef. The world produces enough grain each year to rid the world of hunger, but instead of feeding people with it it goes to feeding cows. These problems are connected.

Oh I totally agree, but to say the absolute answer is "Stop eating beef" seems a little simplistic. How will our culture economically adapt to such a massive shift of everyone suddenly stopping eating beef? Not saying it shouldn't happen but there needs to be more than just black and white answers.

Again, you should read some books on this because it's too involved to answer you in a couple messages on a chat board. I never said stop eating beef was the absolute answer, but the fact is the world could eliminate hunger with the grain they feed cows each year. Of course there's more to it, it's a very complex issue, but the base idea is pretty simple. It's hard to quantify your questioning of the use of "black and white" answers when I'm responding to something as black and white as you saying "feed the starving before worrying about animals".

Another aside to the economic issue is being a cattle farmer is heavily subsidized by tax payer dollars in North America. If you're concerned about the cost to jobs if the demand for beef became reduced you'd find that the government is allotting substantial amounts of tax dollars for the farming industry that could be redirected into other channels. I forget the exact statistic now, but if the government didn't subsidize the beef industry the average cost of a pound of beef would be roughly $33. And what's a pound of beef cost at the grocery store, I'm guessing under $5? That's a lot of tax dollars that could serve people much better in other ways imho.

It's cool that you're interested in this and questioning, but if you want to be fully informed definitely read up on it. Not saying you have to become a vegetarian, but being informed is never a bad thing.

[Andrew]

Wow just found out that Howard Zinn died. RIP BROTHA

Damn!