whose fashion is more wack?

[JRIA]

does anyone wanna see my wang?

[officespace]

no


-warren

[Human-Demise]

music can only really change the world immediately around you.

[Hollow]

music can only really change the world immediately around you.

Noooooot really. I gotta agree with Nick, I think music is influenced by culture, not the other way around. Look at punk rock in the '80's. Almost uniformly against Reagan. How did that work out? Oh yeah, he was elected twice and left office as one of the most popular presidents in history. Reagan changed punk rock, punk rock didn't change Reagan.

[PaulyHC]

Do not let this evolve into a conversation about how crust punks can't change the world.

thats my only motivation for my post, ha

[Human-Demise]

music can only really change the world immediately around you.

Noooooot really. I gotta agree with Nick, I think music is influenced by culture, not the other way around. Look at punk rock in the '80's. Almost uniformly against Reagan. How did that work out? Oh yeah, he was elected twice and left office as one of the most popular presidents in history. Reagan changed punk rock, punk rock didn't change Reagan.

no, what i meant was music can only really affect like a little bubble around you, it would influence how one dresses, to an extent how your home looks, and who one would interact with, id say the influence of music only goes as far as your front door.

[grind/bro]

music can only really change the world immediately around you.

Noooooot really. I gotta agree with Nick, I think music is influenced by culture, not the other way around. Look at punk rock in the '80's. Almost uniformly against Reagan. How did that work out? Oh yeah, he was elected twice and left office as one of the most popular presidents in history. Reagan changed punk rock, punk rock didn't change Reagan.

no, what i meant was music can only really affect like a little bubble around you, it would influence how one dresses, to an extent how your home looks, and who one would interact with, id say the influence of music only goes as far as your front door.

And that is only applicable with some people.

[Hollow]

music can only really change the world immediately around you.

Noooooot really. I gotta agree with Nick, I think music is influenced by culture, not the other way around. Look at punk rock in the '80's. Almost uniformly against Reagan. How did that work out? Oh yeah, he was elected twice and left office as one of the most popular presidents in history. Reagan changed punk rock, punk rock didn't change Reagan.

no, what i meant was music can only really affect like a little bubble around you, it would influence how one dresses, to an extent how your home looks, and who one would interact with, id say the influence of music only goes as far as your front door.

And that is only applicable with some people.

This.

Look at Nick: I wouldn't really be able to tell you exactly what music he likes simply by the way he dresses. I've heard a few (pretty funny) stories of people being shocked by what he listens to.

Honestly, I think we're all like that to one degree or another. Don't get me wrong, I understand we all dress according to a general aesthetic, so really telling one or more of us a part by what we wear is hard. That's basic group mentality and our group is focused on music so there's going to be some uniformity there. However, most people I know listen to far more than punk/metal. So, for example, you could probably pinpoint some of the bands Scott or Bryan likes by reading their patches, but would probably be surprised by some others (say, that I've seen more than one member of Six Brew Bantha goin' off for Vincat).

Now that I think about it, this is an oddly complicated concept. Wearing a certain fashion style is beneficial in a lot of ways: we see someone in a similar fashion style in an unfamiliar place, we recognize a common bond and feel more comfortable approaching and talking to them. It helps bridge gaps and create safety nets for everyone. Think of it as a tribal thing, if you want. The problem comes with how you end up approaching that person (or anyone, for that matter). If you are creating relationships with the people around you based solely on an admittedly shallow reason, then you are generally losing sight of one of the reasons higher thought processes are there in the first place: the ability to behave in context without relying on instinct.

So if you're simply seeing someone in a band shirt and automatically deciding they're cool and then refusing to judge further based on actions, personality, morality, etc. then you're doing it wrong.

tl;dr-have you ever been on the internet? you ever been on the internet...ON WEED?

[dave mac]

ahhh. the old 'can punk rock change the world?' discussion.

A good portion of people who are into punk rock (be it hardcore, crust, street punk etc.) are into it enough that they, for at least a point of time, have their lives totally revolve around the fact that they are into this music/scene. A lot of those people, in turn, develop a world view at least partly influenced by the music. This influence may come from the politics of the bands, the particular ethos of the particular facet of punk rock they find themselves in (straight edge, veganism, anarcho politics, nazism, working class pride, the list can go on forever), or even just developing a disposition towards DIY ethics. For people who were influenced in this way, it is for certain their personal world is different from what it would've been without this influence. Regardless if at the onset of the certain influence finding its way into punk rock because it was a larger cultural phenomena at the time (working with Willa's anti-rightwing politics example) the fact is, these sort of ideas permeate in the music/scene and their influence are still found today (I mean, a subculture is both influenced and in turn influences culture at large. That should be pretty clear to most people) The argument for punk/hardcore being able to change peoples personal worlds is pretty damn sound when you think about it. I highly doubt that anyone involved enough to make regular show attendance a point, or start bands, or be involved in a 'society' which sets up shows for a local hardcore scene could say their life would be the same if they never had punk/hardcore as an influence in their life.

As far as changing the world on a macro level? That is a little bit more of a stretch. To use Veganism as an example, there sure as shit is never going to be a vegan revolution, no matter how many terrible XXXVEGANXXXSTRAIGHTXXXEDGEXXX metalcore bands exist. But, I am willing to place some bets that the amount of people who are vegan or were vegan, for a period of time, is significantly larger than it would've been if veganism hadn't been a major ethos of a certain sect of hardcore punk. It could be argued that their is a possible relation between hardcore punk and an actual demographic change in the amount of meat eaters vs. vegetarians. Am I reaching? Why? What's the significance? I DON'T KNOW!!!

[matai]

I will never quit carhartts, thats for sure!! fuck punk!! just kidding!!! but seriously the best pants! When i first stopped dressing super punk i had no idea what to wear and then i tried to look straight, but fuck, thats hard, not even straight people look straight anymore!


carharrts jackets are great!!